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    What operating system?

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    OS X Yosemite 10.10.5

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    I built a disc using Encore cs6 containing a menu allowing you to choose between 3 different video clips. The menu has a 30 second audio file that plays and the 3 thumbnail buttons are animated (the background is not). When playing the disc using VLC when it gets to the end of the menu it crashes with a runtime error that says "This application has requested the Runtime to terminate it in an unusual way"

    I had set the end action of the menu to go back to the menu thinking it would just restart the menu and play in a loop so that if the user doesn't choose anything the menu will just play that wrong? Anyone know why I'm getting this error or what to do about it?


    Thanks very much - I'm on a huge deadline for a big project so all guidance is REALLY appreciated!

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    Burn the project do disk a see how it goes.

    Might want to use a real dvd program like Power DVD.

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    OS X Yosemite 10.10.5

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    Thanks very much!


    So it crashes when using VLC as soon as the menu is done.

    I subsequently figured out that if I set the menu end action to stop, it will stop instead of crashing (which is kind of a friendlier version of a crash). I also tried to set the menu length to 20 minutes but got an error that it can't make a menu that long. So I tried it at 3 minutes and it worked (it shuts the disc after 3 minutes but I figured that's really long enough) but the audio file is only 30 seconds long so the audio dropped after 30 seconds.


    Is there any other way to do this? Or is it a VLC issue with menus that VLC can't handle looping?

    What would you recommend the settings be for:

    1. Menu End Action

    2. Duration

    3. Loop

    4. Loop #



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    I do not get this problem. VLC plays an Encore motion menu, including animated buttons, with repeats, selects a movie from the menu, and plays, returns to the menu and menu plays repeatedly without error.


    VLC 2.2.6; what version are you using?


    I assume your target is to play this with VLC, not on a TV?


    Menu end action should never be reached (you want the menu to loop back when it ends) and should be set to "stop." (Even though it should never be reached, it may do odd things if set, for example, back to itself.)

    Duration is best set to the shorter of the video and audio motion assets. Odd asset lengths can cause issues.

    You are not using the loop option, so it should be 00;00 and "forever."


    If this is not working, I would create a simple test project. Create a new DVD project. Import from the Encore library the "Crib Menu HD" which has a motion background with it. (Encore will make it DVD sized; we don't care about the oddities of doing that for the test.) Import one file "as timeline." Set the timeline end action to "last menu." Link the first menu button to the timeline and delete the other buttons. Build to a DVD Folder and see what VLC does with it.


    Ignore the animated button option for the test: Encore renders all the motion into one motion background, so all VLC will see is the VOB for menu motion.

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    Hi Neil


    Thank you for your time and help.

    Today I have finalized DVD9 #1 of the 4 DVD9 set. I tested it with an older stand alone DVD player and an old Mac G4. Both played the DVD perfectly (I watched ~+/- 5 minutes half through the DVD, where the LB most likely would have been set; found no issue).


    The Encore project consists of 6, ~1.3 GB videos on 6 timelines with chapter points every 5 minutes, and 6 mp3 files totaling ~126 MB of DVD-ROM content (including an empty AUDIO_TS folder). I presume Encore had a good chance to set the LB between timelines/videos (if this is possible). I selected to add a manual LB point, but Encore did not prompt me to make a selection, and did it automatically. From the tests I ran, it seems this to be the case when there are multiple timelines and chapter points. Encore prompts me to select a LB point, however, only when all videos are on a single timeline with only one chapter point (at the beginning), a setup I never use. Thus I have no choice but to have the LB set automatically by Encore.

    Below is some info of the ISO, physical DVD (built from Encore) and DDP files, in this order (of DVD9 #1 I would like to submit for replication):





    From these results it seems that both layers have identical sizes. Could this mean that the LB was set by Encore exactly half through, and not at a chapter point or between timelines?



    1. Since I read that for higher player compatibility an AUDIO_TS folder is needed, I added one manually (included in the DVD-ROM files). When opening the DVD folder, it appears next to the VIDEO_TS folder, exactly as with commercial DVDs. Is the method I used to add the AUDIO_TS folder safe, or there is a better one?


    2. I do not have access to DDP checker. Thus my question is if the replicated DVD based on the DDP files will be identical to the DVD I burned with Encore (same LB position, etc). Or Encore sets LB position, etc, different for DDP and ISO/DVD folder?


    3. Since PGCEdit did not report any "yellow" empty squares under "Seamless Joint", and since ImgBurn offers only one option for LB position, does this mean that the LB is between videos (ideal)?


    4. Should I change the DDP Layer names from "Layer 1" and "Layer 2" to "Layer 0" and "Layer 1", or this will not fix the naming issue?


    5. What is your opinion - is it safe to submit the DDP files for replication, based on the info I provided here?


    I apologies for writing so much. It would be great if you could answer all 5 questions.

    Thank you very much for your time and patience. I hope we are approaching the end. I intend to start uploading the DDP files, and submit them for replication once I hear from you.



    No apologies necessary at all - this is why we are all here in the first place, and believe me I have had so much help from some folks here the very least I could ever do is help where I am able as I totally understand the frustrations.

    Before I answer the questions, I have to say it is extremely odd that you cannot use manual layer break on a single playlist project - I was able to do this at this end.

    Moving swiftly on, a break at the exact centre of the data implies the break point is just that - split down the middle. Will this cause issues? On older players, almost certainly. On newer Universal ones, probably not - Blu-ray players have a 2 second buffer for this and it is usually carried over to DVD - but I would really recommend resetting the break point manually.. Question time though, so here goes:

    1 - IMGBurn can be set to do this automatically. some older very early players require this folder, but in all honesty they were rare and it is not used unless authoring for DVD-Audio discs. How it is created is irrelevant as long as it is there, just in case - it is much better to play safe rather than be sorry later.

    2 - These should be identical.

    3 - It may well mean this. I would need to see a Video_TS folder to be certain though, or failing that the DDP image. Personally I would run this through Eclipse Image Analysis, just to be sure I get no nasty surprises from the factory later on. If you want to let me see your DDP I will take a look at it......

    4 - It will not fix this - I tried that myself when I found the issue here. What I would do in this case is tell the factory this in advance. It is not a fail anyway - just a warning - but some factories will use this as an excuse to bump a project or try to gouge more money.

    5 - I really would like to see the DDP set before I could say for sure one way or the other. Is this an option?


    I will check in today on a regular basis.....

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    VLC Media Player is extremely flaky with menus, and by the developers own admission is on a "best effort" basis and correct operation is not guaranteed. It is often the same with free players, as the reason they are free is often because they don't want to pay the royalties involved. That said, the VLC developer is a top chap though.


    If you need to do serious checks, I recommend Cyberlink PowerDVD Ultra - this just works, and is what we use to test playback on computer based systems, and on our last large job (we provided 4 BD and 2 DVD for a Box Set) the people who could not play the replicas with media players were all using free players that could not cope with either our Java code, the menus or even both. As soon as they tried using what Ann described perfectly as a "real dvd program" all the problems went away.


    Free media players are usually free for a reason, the main one being they are not worth paying for.

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    I test my DVDs on an actual set-top DVD or Blu-ray player, too many variables with software. Most new computers don't even have an optical drive any more, and in fact if the viewer is meant to view on a PC, give them an HD video as an .mp4 file and skip the old-fashioned DVD. If not meant to view on PC, then don't test on PC. DVDs that do NOT meet spec will often still play on a PC, providing the false assumption that the disc will then play on set-top players - which it may not.





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    Hi Neil


    Thank you very much for the info - very useful indeed.


    I would be very delighted for you to check the DDP files with Eclipse Image Analysis. I've uploaded already the DDP files of 3 DVDs; the last one (its a 4 DVD set) will most probably be uploaded within 8 hours. Once I finish checking all projects with DVD players, I will send you the link. Is it possible to send it privately (i.e. not to disclose it on this forum)? If that's OK, you may contact me via cautberg (at) that I may send you the link via email.


    I was able to set a layer break manually with a single timeline; but not with multiple timelines (the setup for the projects).


    By the way, what exactly is the issue of Encore not placing the LB in the right place? What is a right place, and what happens if it is not set right? Will the player freeze permanently or only for few seconds?


    Hopefully within 8 or 10 hours all projects will be verified, and than I intend to send you the link (via email hopefully).


    Thank you very much.

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    Sorry for delay - been in a major project the last couple of weeks.......

    Can you drop me a PM here with email details please??

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    Jeff, I could not have put this any better than you have.

    All I can add is that things are just as bad, if not worse, on a mac too.

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  • 02/06/18--00:48: Re: DVD Exceeds Bitrate
  • Swapping the audio out for AC3 is not the best way to go - especially with a music title. sorry. Saying "it is good enough" is not the way to go - check out a poem of the same name (Good Enough) by Edgar Guest. This was shown to me back in the days when I still had a "regular" job as a prototype electrician/wireman as a warning. You can get away with AC3 in a film, but it is not good as you are throwing out 7/8 of your data - the bitrate drops from 1536kbps down to a pitiful 192kbps - and losing that much data will result in a very noticeable difference in audio quality. One of the biggest plus points of Blu-ray is the lossless audio, and I have lost count of the DVD films that I have replaced with Blu-ray versions purely for the audio. One of the titles (I shall not name it) has a feature from the director and he states that with the lossless audio instead of the ghastly AC3 that he can hear things in the soundtrack that were simply inaudible before. But I digress, and am waffling on.

    The MainConcept engine in the Encore Media Encoder (and the AME) does not obey it's own settings and the actual peak bitrate will often exceed the set maximum bitrate by as much as 1Mb. I found this out entirely by accident when I got a very similar error to yours, even though I knew the maths worked & if the encoder actually set to it's parameters than it should have been nowhere near peak bitrate. I ran a bitrate checker and sure enough the peaks were a full 1Mbps off - the target rate was correct, but with the combined peak bitrate exceeding the legal maximum of 9800kbps it simply refused to encoder properly. It is not the Adobe implementation either - TotalCode does exactly the same thing.

    A CBR of 8Mbps will not get you a better result than a properly encoded 2-pass VBR will, and at CBR you should be just fine at 7Mbps with PCM Stereo audio.

    Why does this matter? Quite simply because audio is 50% of the production yet never gets even close to that in the production budgets and is often treated as an afterthought yet I ask you when was the last time you watched a film or a docco with the sound down? Personally speaking, given the quality difference on an MPEG-2 file between 7Mbps CBR and 8Mbps CBR is negligible (and probably not even noticeable to 99% of people) and the difference between AC3 & PCM is like night & day, plus speaking as an audio specialist, it feels like a slap in the face when someone takes a mix that I have sweated blood over and throws out 7/8 of the work I did and expects it to magically sound the same........but I am waffling again! You must stop me doing this or I will witter on all day!!


    If it looks "like garbage", then you probably need to check the encoder settings - I see in your screenshot that the source material is 29.97fps Progressive Scan. This is not DVD spec, as DVD are all interlaced at 29.97 and not progressive, so when you go from PS to Interlaced you are losing up to 50% of your vertical resolution due to the field structure. Can I ask what the original source was filmed at please? You really should be just fine at 23.976 progressive (assuming of course that the source is 24fps) as the AME does this one quite well and adds the pull flags for those ancient machines that are incapable of progressive playback.

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    Not on a DVD there isn't!


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    Have you checked the settings in Subtitle Edit?

    With it set to 23.976fps (which is progressive scan) then all your timecodes are going to be totally off when the resulting script is put to a 29.97fps file - you need to set Subtitle Edit to the same framerate as the file you are using.


    If the title is brought into a 29.97fos DVD then you could well have a problem here as the title will end too early - and the sync issue will get worse & worse as you go further into the timeline simply because once a 24fps script is imported into a 29.97 fps clip then everything gets more & more off sync. As an example, timecode in 24fps might read as follows:


    The same place in the project referenced to 29.97 timecode will read instead as


    This is a difference of 6 frames (or a quarter of a minute) at just 3 minutes into the project. By the time we get to an hour into the project the difference becomes as follows:

    24fps = 00:59:14:08

    29.97fps = 00:59:10:24

    Similarly, a timecode of 01:00:00:00 in 29.97fps becomes 01:00:03:14 in 24fps so 3 whole seconds out at the 1 hour point.


    It is absolutely critical that all timecodes are the same throughout the project.

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    Have you tried different fonts, ideally sans serif types?

    Whilst DVD subtitles only allow 3 colours (so no anti-aliasing allowed) things are different in Blu-ray (if using image based subtitles it should be possible to use up to 256 colours) so are you creating for Blu-ray or DVD here please? I am assuming Blu-ray given the size of your images at 1920x1080 - if this is for DVD though, there is half of your problem right there as in DVD not only can you only use image based subtitles if the image is correctly formatted (a white background with 3 colours on it) but it would also need to be the correct resolution, or else your scaling a text image and that is now going from 1920x1080 in square pixels to 720x480 anamorphic (non square pixels) which is never going to look great if being done automatically.....


    So can you please conform the target format?

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    Hi Neil


    My email address is [Link removed by moderator - please do not include personal information in this public forum] - once you reply to it, I can send you the link to the DDP files.


    Yesterday I've sent the replication company the link to the DDP and ISO files. Unfortunately they do not have software to verify DDP files, but only ISO. They said ISO are as reliable as DDP. They can replicate from both DDP and ISO. I'm not sure whether to ask them to replicate from ISO or DDP.


    Thank you very much.

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    Hi there.

    I created subtitles with Adobe Encore. Now I want to have a common mp4 movie file with the open subtitles. Is there any way to create this with Encore?

    Thanks for your answer in advance, Fritz

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    Ich habe Untertitel mit Adobe Encore erstellt. Jetzt will ich eine gängige Video Datei mit den Untertiteln exportieren (z.B. MP4) und nicht eine DVD erstellen. Geht das mit Encore und wenn ja, wie?

    Danke im Voraus für Eure Antworten und beste Grüße, Fritz

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